Episode 249

full
Published on:

18th Oct 2023

Shaping the Future of Pediatric Healthcare with Marcy Doderer

This week on the podcast, Brent sits down with Marcy Doderer, President and CEO of Arkansas Children's where she leads the state of Arkansas' only pediatric health system serving the children of Arkansas and beyond. They begin by discussing the unique aspects of pediatric healthcare, including the wide variations in patient size and conditions that drive increased costs. Marcy shares how she is focused on innovation to find new solutions while maintaining incremental improvements in care delivery. She offers leadership advice on authenticity, being a student of your work, and how everyone can lead from their role. Marcy also talks about the mission-driven culture at Arkansas Children's and her aim to partner across the state to elevate child health.

Transcript
Marcy Doderer:

But to actually heal a child, you need inventive

Marcy Doderer:

spaces, creative spaces, and artful spaces that allow the

Marcy Doderer:

child to still be a child in the midst of all their health care.

Marcy Doderer:

And that costs money. Our spaces are designed differently. Our

Marcy Doderer:

technology is different and it's all costly.

Brent Williams:

Welcome to the Be Epic podcast, brought to you

Brent Williams:

by the Sam M. Walton College of Business at the University of

Brent Williams:

Arkansas. I'm your host, Brent Williams. Together, we'll

Brent Williams:

explore the dynamic landscape of business, and uncover the

Brent Williams:

strategies, insights, and stories that drive business

Brent Williams:

today.

Brent Williams:

Well, today I have with me Marcy Doderer, who is the President

Brent Williams:

and Chief Executive Officer at Arkansas Children's. Welcome,

Brent Williams:

Marcy.

Marcy Doderer:

Thank you. Glad to be here, Brent.

Brent Williams:

Well, I'm glad to have you on the podcast.

Brent Williams:

We've known each other for several years. It's great to

Brent Williams:

reconnect and hear about the wonderful things that you've

Brent Williams:

been doing at Arkansas Children's.

Marcy Doderer:

We do have a lot going on. That's for sure.

Brent Williams:

And you just celebrated 10 years in the role,

Brent Williams:

right? What's some of the highlights?

Marcy Doderer:

So 10 years this week. I moved here in July of

Marcy Doderer:

2013. And I don't think I wasn't that I didn't expect to be here

Marcy Doderer:

for 10 years, but I'm not sure I fully expected 10 years, I

Marcy Doderer:

certainly didn't know where we would be 10 years from now.

Brent Williams:

Well, what what are some of the highlights of of

Brent Williams:

the 10 years as you look back? I'm sure you've kind of

Brent Williams:

reflected.

Marcy Doderer:

Absolutely. And probably one of my proudest

Marcy Doderer:

accomplishments with Arkansas Children's is that we are now a

Marcy Doderer:

two Hospital Health System. That may not sound exciting to some

Marcy Doderer:

people but Arkansas Children's Hospital have been in Little

Marcy Doderer:

Rock for over 110 years now. And five years ago, we opened

Marcy Doderer:

Arkansas Children's Northwest in Springdale, a small community

Marcy Doderer:

Children's Hospital, really perfectly situated in the

Marcy Doderer:

Northwest Arkansas region and serving the needs of those

Marcy Doderer:

children every single day. It has been so successful, we're in

Marcy Doderer:

growth mode, and will soon put shovels in the ground to expand

Marcy Doderer:

that facility.

Brent Williams:

Well, wonderful. Well, you know, you sit in an

Brent Williams:

interesting space in Arkansas being the only system health

Brent Williams:

care system that primarily serves children and pediatric

Brent Williams:

community, what are some of the unique aspects of serving that

Brent Williams:

particular population?

Marcy Doderer:

We've always been in the business of child health

Marcy Doderer:

and child health care, we think about health care, as you know,

Marcy Doderer:

being able to catch the sick and injured when they come to us for

Marcy Doderer:

care. But we also want to make sure we're actively engaging

Marcy Doderer:

with partners across the state to elevate the health of

Marcy Doderer:

children in Arkansas. We've done this pretty remarkably, by

Marcy Doderer:

trying to get further and further from Little Rock and out

Marcy Doderer:

and about. So we have primary care clinics in Pine Bluff and

Marcy Doderer:

Southwest Little Rock, an active clinic and Jonesboro, a home

Marcy Doderer:

visiting system that touches all 75 counties, and of course, the

Marcy Doderer:

two big hospitals, and another clinic in Benton County. So

Marcy Doderer:

we're trying to be as close to kids as we can. Our ultimate aim

Marcy Doderer:

would be to be within 60 miles of every child. And it's not

Marcy Doderer:

because we wish to own and operate every kind of child

Marcy Doderer:

health business there is but because child children are

Marcy Doderer:

really our future. That sounds pretty cliche, and maybe a bit

Marcy Doderer:

trite, but we are experiencing a moment in time where the human

Marcy Doderer:

race is not replacing itself. Birth rate is declining pretty

Marcy Doderer:

steadily year over year. And there will not be enough kids to

Marcy Doderer:

become adults to take care of you and me when we're old. And

Marcy Doderer:

so our stance is that we really have an obligation to stand up

Marcy Doderer:

these kids and help them reach their fullest potential, 700,000

Marcy Doderer:

kids in Arkansas, we we as a health system might only take

Marcy Doderer:

care of 180-200,000 of them individually. But I think we

Marcy Doderer:

could actually be instrumental in creating a fabric of services

Marcy Doderer:

to ensure that kids get the health and are can achieve the

Marcy Doderer:

health status they really need.

Brent Williams:

You know, Marcy, I'm sure you're highly aware

Brent Williams:

clearly of population decline because of being focused on

Brent Williams:

pediatric health care. I'm aware of it because being focused in

Brent Williams:

higher education, of course, you know, that as children grow and

Brent Williams:

graduate high school, that's who's coming to the university.

Brent Williams:

Do you feel like business leaders that you engage with are

Brent Williams:

really aware enough of on this issue that's out there?

Marcy Doderer:

From my perspective, it's not top of

Marcy Doderer:

mind for very many business leaders. They're looking deep in

Marcy Doderer:

their here and now and certainly coming out of the pandemic,

Marcy Doderer:

global business environment has been extraordinarily difficult

Marcy Doderer:

to lead in and lead within and I'm not sure people have stopped

Marcy Doderer:

to think about long term impact on population trends and their

Marcy Doderer:

workforce. Every business I think across our country is

Marcy Doderer:

worried about the workforce of today, we've struggled to fill

Marcy Doderer:

critical positions, unusual things like pediatric ultrasound

Marcy Doderer:

technologist, but also mainstream things we can't find

Marcy Doderer:

staff accountants. You know, so the workforce of today is

Marcy Doderer:

challenging, it's only going to get worse. And I think if we

Marcy Doderer:

could elevate this conversation among the business community,

Marcy Doderer:

and the education community, together, we could figure out

Marcy Doderer:

how we're going to take fewer people and make them better

Marcy Doderer:

prepared to deliver the kind of work we will need 10 years, 20

Marcy Doderer:

years, 50 years from now, service industry, retail

Marcy Doderer:

industry, the medical industry, technology, whatever it might

Marcy Doderer:

be, every one of those industries will have fewer

Marcy Doderer:

people to work in their spaces. So what can we be thinking of

Marcy Doderer:

now that actually replaces the need for the human hand in a way

Marcy Doderer:

that still allows work to be engaging, fruitful, inspiring,

Marcy Doderer:

and attractive to people who will be working.

Brent Williams:

Absolutely. And if and I guess as you're, as

Brent Williams:

you're thinking about that, and in your own business, or you

Brent Williams:

know pediatric systems throughout, you know, the world

Brent Williams:

probably that you're engaged in, I'm sure automation, generative

Brent Williams:

AI, those types of technologies are on your mind and how you're

Brent Williams:

gonna, I guess, bring those alongside your people to solve

Brent Williams:

some of those.

Marcy Doderer:

Absolutely. And I can give you an example that we

Marcy Doderer:

worked on in the last year. It's very healthcare specific, but it

Marcy Doderer:

was leveraging automation in business systems. In healthcare

Marcy Doderer:

when you have a government payer as a major source of your

Marcy Doderer:

revenue stream, which we do at Arkansas Children's, Arkansas

Marcy Doderer:

Medicaid is our primary payer, you have a series of what we

Marcy Doderer:

call cost reports. It's a year end auditing process of

Marcy Doderer:

assessing what it costs us to deliver care for the Medicaid

Marcy Doderer:

kids that we took care of. And it's a very involved, detailed,

Marcy Doderer:

lengthy way of reporting back to the state, what they owe us for

Marcy Doderer:

the care we delivered and what it really costs us to deliver

Marcy Doderer:

that care. It's been a very manual system. Since the

Marcy Doderer:

beginning of time, it feels like. But between our

Marcy Doderer:

Information Systems team and our Finance team, they've been able

Marcy Doderer:

to really, almost fully automate how federal and state level cost

Marcy Doderer:

report gets populated. That may not sound very exciting to

Marcy Doderer:

anyone. But what the reality is our team who works in cost

Marcy Doderer:

accounting, they don't want to be data manipulators, which is

Marcy Doderer:

what they've been by completely automating the process, their

Marcy Doderer:

checks and balances of the cost report is reduced significantly

Marcy Doderer:

in terms of man hours, allowing them to change their view and

Marcy Doderer:

really be the data analyst that they are. And I think every kind

Marcy Doderer:

of rote, mundane kind of business function that we could

Marcy Doderer:

automate, to allow the people to be the thinking, creative minds

Marcy Doderer:

that a human can be, every business will benefit from that.

Marcy Doderer:

AI is a little interesting, one, I think it's here to stay. And

Marcy Doderer:

it's actually going to just boom, it's very scary to some,

Marcy Doderer:

because I think people feel it may replace people in their

Marcy Doderer:

work. But it definitely has a role. And there's, again,

Marcy Doderer:

there's some rote kind of work that we do that we think AI can

Marcy Doderer:

be extraordinarily helpful with, we think of all the

Marcy Doderer:

documentation that occurs in a healthcare transaction. When you

Marcy Doderer:

visit your own personal physician, she or he is having

Marcy Doderer:

to document deeply in a medical record to assess current state

Marcy Doderer:

and your problem list and what the prediction or prognosis is

Marcy Doderer:

for the future. There's a lot of ways AI can help with that and

Marcy Doderer:

make that easier on the provider, giving them

Marcy Doderer:

opportunity to spend more face time with you. But there's some

Marcy Doderer:

also, I think, really interesting, unintended

Marcy Doderer:

consequences of that kind of AI. And here's another example that

Marcy Doderer:

we're kind of wrestling with in health care. We can use

Marcy Doderer:

automation and a form of AI to help our radiologist read

Marcy Doderer:

routine and simple radiology images. The idea was to free up

Marcy Doderer:

the radiologist, the human, the medical doctor, to spend their

Marcy Doderer:

time really focusing on the unusual imaging services that

Marcy Doderer:

are really acute and need immediate attention. MRI and CT

Marcy Doderer:

and brain scans, tumor scans heart issues. Well, what they're

Marcy Doderer:

finding though, is the human brain works best when it has

Marcy Doderer:

some lulls in its day and by removing all of the routine

Marcy Doderer:

chest X rays or plain film orthopedic images, we're forcing

Marcy Doderer:

radiologists to spend their 8, 10, 12 hours a day looking at

Marcy Doderer:

the really intense stuff. And it's overwhelming to a person's

Marcy Doderer:

brain, it's exhausting. And so we actually need to come back to

Marcy Doderer:

some a little bit of a middle ground because behavioral

Marcy Doderer:

scientist and brain scientists also know our brains like a

Marcy Doderer:

little downtime, not to be just on a break, and not engaging in

Marcy Doderer:

anything, but to allow the brain to kind of operate a bit on

Marcy Doderer:

autopilot. So I think there's some unintended consequences of

Marcy Doderer:

trying to automate everything and forcing people to just the

Marcy Doderer:

highest function, because we may burn them out even faster than

Marcy Doderer:

we're doing today.

Brent Williams:

How interesting. That's a very interesting

Brent Williams:

example, you know, and backing up, I would say, I totally agree

Brent Williams:

with you of the exciting thing I think about the development of

Brent Williams:

technologies like AI, generative AI, is the ability for humans to

Brent Williams:

no longer have to do many of those rote tasks and use their

Brent Williams:

creative abilities that only a human can do. But I think as as,

Brent Williams:

as leaders and managers, and I heard someone say this,

Brent Williams:

actually, this week, can use the word harmonizing technology and

Brent Williams:

people.

Marcy Doderer:

I like that phrase.

Brent Williams:

Yeah, me too. It really, it really stuck with me.

Brent Williams:

And I think that's sort of what you're saying with this example.

Brent Williams:

Like, how do we get technology and people working together in a

Brent Williams:

harmonized way, so that both can be best utilized, and so that

Brent Williams:

the person can get the most joy out of the work?

Marcy Doderer:

You think about healthcare, particularly in

Marcy Doderer:

hospital care. When a child is confined to a hospital room days

Marcy Doderer:

on end, and they're still aware of enough of their surroundings,

Marcy Doderer:

they really look forward to engaging with people. There's

Marcy Doderer:

some rote tasks that we've thought about replacing with

Marcy Doderer:

robots, delivering a patient's food tray, for example, pretty

Marcy Doderer:

simple technology, it's out there, it's being used today, a

Marcy Doderer:

robot can, you know, the thing can be loaded with the patient

Marcy Doderer:

trays in the kitchen, it knows how to move up and down the

Marcy Doderer:

hallways and up and down the elevators and can stop outside

Marcy Doderer:

the room. So a parent or someone could get their tray. But if you

Marcy Doderer:

remove the opportunity for the people who usually deliver to

Marcy Doderer:

the tray to stop and engage with the family, and really check in

Marcy Doderer:

on the emotional status of that child, not just the blood

Marcy Doderer:

pressure, the temperature, that kind of thing, we might actually

Marcy Doderer:

dehumanize healthcare and that we don't want to do that. So I

Marcy Doderer:

love that concept of harmonizing the technology with how we're

Marcy Doderer:

delivering care.

Brent Williams:

Me too. Well, you, you lead an organization in

Brent Williams:

a challenging space in healthcare. And you know, many

Brent Williams:

of you are probably aware, we're all engaged in healthcare as as

Brent Williams:

people and consumers, but I'm not sure if, if everyone

Brent Williams:

listening would understand the real challenges of trying to

Brent Williams:

operate in that system, med. You know, I thought maybe from your

Brent Williams:

perspective, like what are some of the key challenges that you

Brent Williams:

all face as you as you operate within this US system?

Marcy Doderer:

Well, healthcare is highly regulated. And those

Marcy Doderer:

regulations create a burden, an administrative burden that

Marcy Doderer:

doesn't always come with a revenue stream for us and every

Marcy Doderer:

hospital in the country is faced with that not just pediatric

Marcy Doderer:

health care. But I do think it's amplified in pediatric

Marcy Doderer:

healthcare because our, the floor of our cost structure is,

Marcy Doderer:

unfortunately, by design higher. So more costly than in a

Marcy Doderer:

traditional adult hospital, for a number of reasons. Start first

Marcy Doderer:

with people. We need people who are actually trained in

Marcy Doderer:

pediatric specialist specialties to take care of kids. Our

Marcy Doderer:

children have a different anatomy, different physiology,

Marcy Doderer:

different medical needs. I mean, their diagnoses are literally

Marcy Doderer:

different than in the adult space. And people need to get

Marcy Doderer:

trained to take care of kids, not just adults, and that

Marcy Doderer:

training takes more time. Therefore, it costs more money,

Marcy Doderer:

a cost structure goes up. When you think about our slot supply

Marcy Doderer:

chain, we source our supplies many times from the same vendors

Marcy Doderer:

and places that an adult hospital is but we actually need

Marcy Doderer:

way more supplies than an adult facility. So think just in terms

Marcy Doderer:

of blood pressure cuffs, and I actually wish we're on a podcast

Marcy Doderer:

but I wish I could show visual aids because it's pretty

Marcy Doderer:

impactful. Any day, anytime in a children's hospital we have

Marcy Doderer:

micro preemies, so babies born that way less than a pound. And

Marcy Doderer:

we might actually have a 500 pound teenager suffering for

Marcy Doderer:

more morbid obesity. So we would have a blood pressure cuff

Marcy Doderer:

that's about the size of a band aid that can fit on a premature

Marcy Doderer:

infant. And then we need a blood pressure cuff that can fit

Marcy Doderer:

around the arm or the leg of a 500 pound person and every size

Marcy Doderer:

in between. Well multiply that by oxygen masks, tiny, tiny

Marcy Doderer:

oxygen masks, full size oxygen oxygen mask, multiply that by

Marcy Doderer:

diapers like a diaper, that's literally the size of a post it

Marcy Doderer:

note to a full size, extra extra large depends for an

Marcy Doderer:

incontinent, bigger person, and everything in between. So the

Marcy Doderer:

cost of inventory, the cost of our supply chain is very

Marcy Doderer:

different than adult size. From a capital standpoint, the same

Marcy Doderer:

thing is true from hospital beds. Bassinets designed for an

Marcy Doderer:

infant to a bariatric bed designed for a 500 pound person.

Marcy Doderer:

And it just goes on and on. And that creates a layer of costs

Marcy Doderer:

that doesn't happen in the adult world. And I can say that with

Marcy Doderer:

ease was actually worked in adult hospitals, I've had the

Marcy Doderer:

experience of being in a 700 bed, academic hospital in a

Marcy Doderer:

large urban town, those kinds of things make it very different.

Marcy Doderer:

The people are different, the supply chain, the things are

Marcy Doderer:

different, and then the spaces are very different. And that

Marcy Doderer:

makes our burden of delivering high quality, low cost patient

Marcy Doderer:

centered care, more challenging, I believe, than in just a

Marcy Doderer:

general adult community hospital.

Brent Williams:

You know, I I had never thought about the

Brent Williams:

variations, you know, physiologically, I guess in in

Brent Williams:

your patient relative to adult it makes sense clearly when you

Brent Williams:

say it, but when you hear pediatrics or children or adult,

Brent Williams:

you kind of think one or two. But wow, what a you're right,

Brent Williams:

you're dealing with a vast variation.

Marcy Doderer:

The last piece I would land on there that I think

Marcy Doderer:

is such an exciting field in medicine right now. And more

Marcy Doderer:

costly than I think the average Arkansan would even understand,

Marcy Doderer:

medical technology, medical science, and research and

Marcy Doderer:

discovery have been creating novel pediatric drugs,

Marcy Doderer:

pharmaceuticals, to solve for conditions that were fatal in

Marcy Doderer:

the past. Neuro, neuromuscular conditions that children are

Marcy Doderer:

born with that children don't live to be, but maybe two or

Marcy Doderer:

three years old. There are now not just life altering, but life

Marcy Doderer:

saving drugs that we are delivering to these children in

Marcy Doderer:

Arkansas and all over the country, probably the world.

Marcy Doderer:

Single doses of those draw those drugs are seven figures. So a

Marcy Doderer:

million dollars or more per dose. And that's not just cost

Marcy Doderer:

on the hospital, right, we would negotiate that with payers, we

Marcy Doderer:

work with sources of revenue to ensure that the drug gets paid

Marcy Doderer:

for back to the pharmaceutical company. But that's not a

Marcy Doderer:

sustainable future for us, except that it is a sustainable

Marcy Doderer:

future for that one child who now will live. And for that

Marcy Doderer:

family who sees hope. And so that that's a fascinating,

Marcy Doderer:

probably just in the last five years, piece of our world that's

Marcy Doderer:

becoming more and more challenging to maneuver that

Marcy Doderer:

everyone wants to figure out how we're going to navigate that

Marcy Doderer:

space, because we're going to actually save children's lives

Marcy Doderer:

and going back to the population decline, we need to save every

Marcy Doderer:

one of those children's lives.

Brent Williams:

Absolutely. Well, I assume you know, working

Brent Williams:

in pediatrics that that your team is a very mission driven

Brent Williams:

team, purposeful team. You know, as as I've gotten to know, we've

Brent Williams:

worked together over the last, let's say, five or six years. I

Brent Williams:

know, you know, it seems to me like you've had a significant

Brent Williams:

focus on innovation and driving innovation in the organization

Brent Williams:

or equipping maybe your leaders and teams with innovation. You

Brent Williams:

know, how did you, what was what drove your recognition of the

Brent Williams:

need for that? And how have you gone about it?

Marcy Doderer:

It's a great question. And I don't know that

Marcy Doderer:

I have a perfect answer for you. I I'm often viewed in my CEO

Marcy Doderer:

colleague space is a bit contrarian in the world of

Marcy Doderer:

innovation in the past, because people in healthcare, love to

Marcy Doderer:

think we are incredibly innovative. In the moment in the

Marcy Doderer:

delivery of care, I would state quite firmly that we are not

Marcy Doderer:

often innovative. We're great at incremental improvement. The

Marcy Doderer:

margin of error of pediatric healthcare is really small. And

Marcy Doderer:

not many families would say they want to be the first. And so in

Marcy Doderer:

the care delivery system in the hospitals in the clinics as we

Marcy Doderer:

talk to families, we are incrementally better, really

Marcy Doderer:

well. We have great improvement science techniques. We are very

Marcy Doderer:

robust in our process improvement and process design.

Marcy Doderer:

And we need to keep that going in the moment of care. But it is

Marcy Doderer:

also true that we have got to come, we have to be able to

Marcy Doderer:

create space that allows teams to really think innovatively in

Marcy Doderer:

a way that isn't just improving today's solution. It really is

Marcy Doderer:

completely different. So we have invested time in trying to seek

Marcy Doderer:

out champions for innovation to create free up space, I guess is

Marcy Doderer:

the best way to say that in one's day to learn about how to

Marcy Doderer:

think differently, learn how to be innovative, to give them the

Marcy Doderer:

tools to really explore a very different solution, rather than

Marcy Doderer:

just exploring a better way of doing what we're already doing

Marcy Doderer:

today. And I'm hoping that makes sense and isn't inarticulate on

Marcy Doderer:

a podcast. So we've, we've partnered with the University of

Marcy Doderer:

Arkansas, we've partnered with the University of Arkansas for

Marcy Doderer:

Medical Sciences to think about how you take clinicians who are

Marcy Doderer:

so good at incremental change and break them away from that

Marcy Doderer:

and give them a space where they can actually do transformative

Marcy Doderer:

change. So we do that by building, the even at the core

Marcy Doderer:

of our work, a culture that's built on discovery and

Marcy Doderer:

curiosity. So when I interview people I'm looking for what was

Marcy Doderer:

the last thing you learned that was new? How did you learn

Marcy Doderer:

something new, whether it was work related or not, trying to

Marcy Doderer:

assess for a team members interest in their curiosity

Marcy Doderer:

level, in their interest, discovering something new and

Marcy Doderer:

doing things differently and I think, if we do that senior

Marcy Doderer:

leadership, or we do that with frontline leaders, or frontline

Marcy Doderer:

staff, we can create a culture that is naturally geared towards

Marcy Doderer:

discovery and insightful ways of looking at things that will

Marcy Doderer:

promote innovation in a very different space.

Brent Williams:

That totally makes sense to me, the way you

Brent Williams:

explained it. Really trying to give your team space that allows

Brent Williams:

them to think outside of your lump and, and transform them

Brent Williams:

together. So totally makes sense to me. And we've been pleased to

Brent Williams:

be a part of that. Maybe, maybe transitioning to leadership. You

Brent Williams:

know, I mean, when I when I when I think about interacting with

Brent Williams:

you over the years, clearly we've interacted around

Brent Williams:

innovation, but I love your style of leadership. And as you

Brent Williams:

as you think about our students, Marcy, you know, the Sam M.

Brent Williams:

Walton College of Business is really producing the next

Brent Williams:

leaders of the organizations throughout the state and region.

Brent Williams:

You know, what, what advice would you start to give them?

Brent Williams:

Maybe let's start with leadership. And like, how do you

Brent Williams:

develop and how did you develop your own framework of

Brent Williams:

leadership?

Marcy Doderer:

I think I was drawn to leadership really,

Marcy Doderer:

really early in my life, which may not be a typical path. But,

Marcy Doderer:

if you were to rewind the clock all the way to high school, I

Marcy Doderer:

always lifted my hand to, you know, be nominated for an

Marcy Doderer:

officer in a high school club. And

Brent Williams:

Were you in the first row of the classroom?

Marcy Doderer:

Many times. Sadly. My mom would tell you

Marcy Doderer:

that, you know, as a five year old, I was the one going, I want

Marcy Doderer:

to say why, I want to determine the why. And I think that was

Marcy Doderer:

what drove me. I really had this innate curiosity to always want

Marcy Doderer:

to understand why and then realize, you know, what, I could

Marcy Doderer:

define that why maybe better than others. So that drove me

Marcy Doderer:

into leadership. One of the things that kept me in

Marcy Doderer:

leadership really has been this passion I have for developing

Marcy Doderer:

others and helping people see, you can be a leader from any

Marcy Doderer:

seat you sit in. And I think that's an important lesson for

Marcy Doderer:

students. Not everyone wants to be a CEO, not everyone can be a

Marcy Doderer:

CEO. I mean, it's a pretty steep pinnacle, right? There's only

Marcy Doderer:

one at the top. And so, you don't have to reach even the C

Marcy Doderer:

suite to be an extraordinary leader. And leading is by

Marcy Doderer:

creating that vision for a group of people who will follow you to

Marcy Doderer:

do something better and improve on whatever whatever it is,

Marcy Doderer:

whatever business you're in. My own experience in leadership in

Marcy Doderer:

terms of success is leading first with authenticity and

Marcy Doderer:

integrity. I think that was pretty natural for me, but it

Marcy Doderer:

was rein- reinforced by mentors I've had through my career. And

Marcy Doderer:

I think sadly, women sometimes get steered a little differently

Marcy Doderer:

that they they a persona around them that they think the world

Marcy Doderer:

is expecting and they leave a bit of their personal life or

Marcy Doderer:

their personal approach to the side. And I would never

Marcy Doderer:

encourage anyone to do that. Well one lesson I learned really

Marcy Doderer:

early in my career was kind of battling a bit of that. Being a

Marcy Doderer:

little worried about being the only female voice on an

Marcy Doderer:

executive team, which I had the experience of, and thinking I

Marcy Doderer:

needed to frame my thoughts and my interjections the same way

Marcy Doderer:

all of my male counterparts were and yet that isn't the tone of

Marcy Doderer:

my normal voice, in terms of the cadence of the words or the way

Marcy Doderer:

I think or the way I might problem solve. And when I got

Marcy Doderer:

comfortable with self that wasn't an outside world telling

Marcy Doderer:

me to do that it was internal, and just decided to be myself

Marcy Doderer:

that it was almost as if the team around me was like, well,

Marcy Doderer:

thank goodness, Marcy is now here, you because they knew me

Marcy Doderer:

in that way individually. And then I'd get to the big table,

Marcy Doderer:

and be a bit cowed by that. And I think finding your own voice

Marcy Doderer:

and leading with that level of authenticity, the teams around

Marcy Doderer:

you will welcome that. Yeah, it won't be perfect, but nothing

Marcy Doderer:

is. I would also suggest you be a student of your work. I have

Marcy Doderer:

had that conversation with team members. People often comment,

Marcy Doderer:

how do you remember that stuff? How do you know those numbers so

Marcy Doderer:

well? I've been a student my whole life. I'm 55 years old and

Marcy Doderer:

10 years into this CEO job and I still study our work every day.

Marcy Doderer:

I mean, I spent time yesterday really looking deeply at some

Marcy Doderer:

statistics around food insecurity, just so I could

Marcy Doderer:

understand it differently because of a conversation that's

Marcy Doderer:

coming up. And there's a lot of noise in our world telling us to

Marcy Doderer:

know certain things or to be certain ways or to be pulled in

Marcy Doderer:

different directions. And if students or young leaders, new

Marcy Doderer:

grads in their first roles, can learn how to put a lot of the

Marcy Doderer:

noise aside and be a student of what it is you wish to do, what

Marcy Doderer:

you are doing today and what it is she wished to do in the

Marcy Doderer:

future, you will know your work better than anyone else. And

Marcy Doderer:

with that will come growth in your career.

Brent Williams:

Well Marcy. I love the viewpoint on

Brent Williams:

authenticity. Each one of us are individuals, we're unique, we

Brent Williams:

bring something unique. And that's actually what can make an

Brent Williams:

organization and a team really special is when everyone brings

Brent Williams:

those experiences and their unique self to bear and and then

Brent Williams:

that mixes together and creates a pretty unique history.

Marcy Doderer:

I went it was reinforced for me just recently,

Marcy Doderer:

I was out rounding, I do this a lot to get out of my office and

Marcy Doderer:

go spend time on one of the patient care units. And I was on

Marcy Doderer:

one of our medical units a few days ago, and there was a new

Marcy Doderer:

member on the team and I stopped and I she looked a little

Marcy Doderer:

frightened that I walked up to her I had a business suit on and

Marcy Doderer:

you know, didn't wasn't wearing scrubs. And I said hi I'm Marcy,

Marcy Doderer:

I said I can tell by the color your scrubs you're one of our

Marcy Doderer:

student interns this summer because our team members are

Marcy Doderer:

color coded in scrubs, which really helps me know what they

Marcy Doderer:

do. And she kind of had a little frightened look on her face and

Marcy Doderer:

one of her teammates and I think was her preceptor Kelly walks up

Marcy Doderer:

and puts her arm around her. She's like, don't worry. That's

Marcy Doderer:

just Marcy. She's one of us. You'll get to know her as you

Marcy Doderer:

work here. I was like thank you, Kelly. I appreciate that. And

Marcy Doderer:

then I visibly saw the shoulders relax on the student intern. And

Marcy Doderer:

she told me her name. And I welcomed her at Arkansas

Marcy Doderer:

Children's. But Kelly, the team member was comfortable doing

Marcy Doderer:

that for a CEO because she knows me. And that comes with leading

Marcy Doderer:

with authenticity.

Brent Williams:

Absolutely. Well, Marcy, I want to say thank

Brent Williams:

you to you and to Arkansas Children's for the way that you

Brent Williams:

serve our state and should be the future of our state.

Marcy Doderer:

Thank you so much. I have the best job in the

Marcy Doderer:

state of Arkansas. And Arkansas Children's has such a bright

Marcy Doderer:

future as one of the preeminent health care systems in our

Marcy Doderer:

state. And I think the children of Arkansas will be better for

Marcy Doderer:

the work we will do as Arkansas Children's but more importantly

Marcy Doderer:

the work Arkansas Children's will do in partnership with

Marcy Doderer:

people like you and the University of Arkansas

Marcy Doderer:

partnership with business and other community advocates who

Marcy Doderer:

are out there wanting to make sure every child can reach their

Marcy Doderer:

fullest potential. So thanks for your time.

Brent Williams:

Absolutely. Well, I know one thing we share

Brent Williams:

and that is a passion for the future of this state. So thank

Brent Williams:

you for joining us today.

Marcy Doderer:

Absolutely. Have a great day.

Brent Williams:

You too.

Brent Williams:

On behalf of the Walton College, thank you for joining us for

Brent Williams:

this captivating conversation. To stay connected and never miss

Brent Williams:

an episode, simply search for Be Epic on your preferred podcast

Brent Williams:

service.

Next Episode All Episodes Previous Episode

Listen for free

Show artwork for Be EPIC Podcast

About the Podcast

Be EPIC Podcast
Welcome to the Be Epic Podcast featuring Brent Williams, interim dean of the Sam M. Walton College of Business at the University of Arkansas. In each episode, you will hear from guests that will inspire you to be epic. As experts in their field, they will emphasize strategy, leadership, and entrepreneurship. This programming will highlight innovation and cutting-edge information that will leave you wanting more. Be sure to connect with Brent Williams on LinkedIn to join the conversation, access show notes and discover fantastic bonus content.